The hype has died down. As best I can tell a few people sign up for free membership per hour. Needless to say there is no real momentum for all the promised spillover.

If it truly was a good company people would still be joining by the dozens!

When it was all hyped up and everyone was promoting it dozens of people were signing up PER MINUTE. Not per day.

I expect it to continue to die off. The founders will launch a new company with a new name using the same concept. They’ll make some money and do it again and again again. These guys don’t make these kind of businesses to survive long term. They are quick hits. They have a big launch and it dies off. Then they either do a relaunch or create a new company, new name, and do a new launch.

- Ben Fitts

I agree 100% about the “carrot dangling” thing and have heard that many members didn’t see a drop of the spillover they were expecting. Many people signed up a lot of members beneath them during pre-launch, but not many of those pre-enrollees upgraded. Also, many people paid and then were very disappointed with the “products”, and therefore requested refunds. When the matrix was compressed and only the paid members were left, well… it seems there just wasn’t that many paid members.
But just to let everyone know, I made my refund request on Jan 26th and received the refund today (Feb 3rd), so they are at least honoring the refund requests. However, it is too late for many folks, since there is only a 15-day window to request one.
Here are a just few more blogs pointing out the disappointments of WebProsperity (there are more, but I’m not gonna go crazy):

http://debbieturner.com/web-prosperity-an-initial-disappointment-for-many-internet-marketers/

http://gutzmarketingblog.com/2009/01/21/web-prosperity-did-not-win-my-vote

http://trafficvibe.blogspot.com/2009/01/why-i-cancelled-my-web-prosperity.html

The irregularity of the spillover during pre-launch is a deceitful act on the part of Webprosperity to dangle a carrot infront of members, only to take it away after the compression. Frankly, after the compression, we should see the same spillover since this is a forced 2×15 matrix.

Read this:

http://www.warriorforum.com/plug-profit-site-support-forum/39621-stone-evans-web-prosperity-launch-promotion-emails-3.html#post481234

Thomas,
I do not get it regarding the spillover. How did 327.766 people come about at level 5?

On another front, spillover for me is very difficult to understand and so far, all the MLM systems where spillover is mentioned, they never explain spillover and the mathematics of it. So, everyone is imagining and assuming what the spillover is purely by the hype generated by the snake-oil seller. In WP case, the snake-oil seller is David.

Let me try to ask the question about spillover this way, Thomas.

1. Assume Stone personally sign-up 2 enrollees – Peter and Paul.
In a 2×15 forced matrix, he has two legs – a left and a right leg.
At 1st Level: System puts Peter on his left, Paul on his right.

2. Stone goes on to recruit a third and fourth enrollee – Peter2 and Paul2.
Since his left and right are already filled, he have to put Peter2 and Paul2 on his 2nd Level.
At 2nd Level: System puts Peter2 below Peter1 and Paul2 below Peter1.

Now you get what I mean? If what most of us understand “spillover” to mean, it would mean that Peter1 will experience the spillover from his upline Stone when Stone signs-up his third enrollee Peter2, since in a 2xN matrix, it is a forced matrix and spillover happens not by chance, but by the matrix structure. It is forced to spillover.

Assume nobody else works but only Stone. Now, this gets interesting if my explanation about how a spillover works in a forced 2×15 matrix, like WP’s.

Take you all the way down to the 14th Level.

As you have noted, at the 14th Level, there will be 16,384 enrollees, giving a sub-total of 32,766 enrollees, of which 16,382 (which is 32,766 minus 16,384) would have 2 spillovers from Stone, each of them would have 2 spillovers from Stone. You will notice that means about half will get 2 spillovers from Stone and half of his tree don’t. The half that don’t get any spillover is always the last level of stone’s matrix, regardless of which level he has built and it will always be half of his total enrollees getting his 2 spillovers and half of them don’t.

Let’s get all the way down to the last Level, the 15th Level.
By the same mathematics, at the 15th Level, he needs 32,768 enrollees to fill this level up. Above this level, at the 14th Level to the 1st Level, all his enrollees would have received 2 spillovers from Stone, each.

That works out to be, from your calculation 32,766.
Hence, 32,766 (which is 65,532 minus 32,768) will have 2 spillovers from Stone, each. It also means half of his tree gets 2 spillovers from him, and half does not.

It will always be this way.

But the interesting conclusion to make out of this is very simple. If in a room filled with Stone’s enrollees, if you ask two persons, you should get one of them saying he got spillover and half of them saying no. Such a percentage of 50/50 is vey high.

Now, if we extrapolate this to the mother of all trees, that of the Webprosperity tree, if we per-chance ask two active members, you should get one to say he got 2 spillovers from his upline and half say no.

Notice that in this scenario, only Stone works and everyone else sits, laze around and drink coffee other than work.

Can you imagine if everyone in the matrix up till the 14th Level should work and brings in just one(1) enrollee?

It means that there will be 32,766 new members and this would be forced all the way down the matrix to fill up the 15th Level for Stone, short 2 persons. But anyway, if he signs-up his parents at the 15th Level, he would have filled up his 2×15 matrix and he needs only bring in 32,768 and everyone in his tree brings in just one person, and his matrix is done.

Interesting, isn’t it? But the fact that EVERYONE here we speak to and all the others in other forums and blogs did not get ANY spillover, does this mean that Webprosperity is rigged? Or does it mean that only sour grapes are heard here and elsewhere?

Nevermind, let me solve this mystery here then. I had signed-up an account each with Stone Evans, Ewen Chia, Glen Mosser, David D’archangelo and Simon G. I can safely tell you this now. NONE of them (damned) accounts got any spillovers.

So, the truth is told. Make our own deductions and let the law go after the masterminds of this scam.

I have submitted for my refunds BUT like the rest here who posted on this, I have NOT received any reply from Webprosperity and it is already a week now.

During the pre-launch, my genealogy has two spillovers of PAID members from my uplines when it should not be since the matrix is not compressed then. So, why did I get 2 PAID spillovers then? This is highly irregular.

Now, after the launch and when the matrix is compressed by flushing out the unpaid members, the two PAID members in my spillover conveniently or strangely disappeared from my genealogy.

Now, I can only see my personally enrolled and PAID members. The much anticipated spillover from my uplines NEVER materialised. Nothing.

So, there you have it, Ben. You are right all along. In the blog, members are talking about training new members on the use of the products and applauding the products. BUT no one talks about the spillover or the total lack of it. This is so obviously ghost writers pitching their own agenda on the blog.

Now, WP is hyping about the products and is silent on why there is no spillovers. A forced 2×15 matrix must result in spillovers since David boasted that 100,000 had activated their positions and became PAID members. Mathematically, to fill a forced 2×15 matrix, with David at the top, takes only 32,000 odd PAID members. So, with 100,000 PAID members already by the last day of pre-launch, the matrix would have bursted its rim 3 times over.

Not writing to express this at the WP blog because it would be moderated for sure. So, this is sharing the sinking feeling with other similar lambs like me who looks at the opportunity and compensation rather than the products. In any case, the products I have tried out and they are buggy and basic. So, the products are definitely overpriced by market standards, as others can attest to it.

Hope others can share their honest views about WP and not allow the deceit to flourish and suck more innocent people into it. David is definitely proving that he will never change his ways and his past is dubious at most, for those who do a little research on him, it is not difficult to find out about him. I am totally waylaid with my own eyes opened but I am still opening my eyes, now even wider in bewilderment at how this deceit is gonna play out soon.

Firstly, everyone joins for free so crunch time happens when the first compression is done. So, I’ve locked in my position, so I can review the products when I can get a chance to use them as I already have a Getresponse list.

here are 2 things I’ve found though,

1. you only get the video conferencing and the ability to put audio/video on your site, if you order the elite package. I’m not sure wheter, if you get the Premium package that “Contact” will be equivelent to Getresponse at the current price. So watch that one.

2. If you don’t promote it, and choose to just sit there, then I hope you’ve got a busy upline team, and if you have you’re only gonna make 30 bucks from spill-over. When people realize this, I guess it wil dwindle like Probuilderplus.

So Ben, I kind of agree with you, but with Implix behind it, we know the products will be good and there are plenty of newbie marketers around like me who could use an all-in-one solution like this so that’s it’s target market imo.

I hate hype and especially forced matrixes, powerlines and binaries. I am the CEO of Veretekk.com, Inc. Veretekk offers web conference rooms, autoresponders, lead capture portals, has over 100 professional live trainers teaching Internet marketing, massive marketing tools especially the ability to get top SEO position in very competitive markets. It took 10 years to build it. You would think David would contact me before launching Web Prosperity. He didn’t. One must wonder why.

Veretekk does have a three level (uni level) affiliate program. But 90% of our subscribers are customers and use the system to build their business and presence on the Internet. We have subscribers in every country in the world. Our customers are very happy. There is no such thing as get rich quick. Success takes a well thought out plan, hard work and patience’s as it takes years to accomplish anything that is stable.

I wish David Darcangelo the best.

—————————————————–

Thank you for your reply.

Yes, you can login to the conference calls via ordinary phone by simply dialling a number that will be visible in your WebProsperity back-office after you have upgraded your account to member after the launch.

Joining in on the conference calls do not require the caller to have some special software.

I apologize for any incorrect package information, however these are the correct package details:

——————————————————–
Premium Builder package $29.95/month
——————————————————–
Contact: 3 campaigns + default campaign
Media: not available
Meeting: not available
Finder: available
AddressBook: 200 unique contacts
Calendar: available

—————————————————
Elite Builder package $59.95/month
—————————————————
Contact: unlimited campaigns
Media: unlimited files, pictures and documents
Meeting: 200 conference recipients
Finder: available
AddressBook: unlimited contacts
Calendar: available

There will be no free trial period as such, however we do offer a 15 day full money back guarantee so if you are not satisfied, simply contact us within 15 days of upgrading your prelaunch account and we will cancel your account and issue a refund back to the Credit Card that was used.

This is going to be another E4L that stays in pre-launch forever.

Good write up Ben!

Forest

First of all Web Prosperity does have a product, one that may not be for everyone just like your product may not be for everyone. Secondly, it is not a straightline. Get your facts straight before you bash another company. I am sure that I can look at the program that you are promoting and find fault with the compensation plan as well as the products. Don’t put down another company to promote yours, that is what is wrong with this business. Web Prosperity hasn’t even launched yet and you are talking about them possibly failing. I guess that empowers you. Get it straight!

Where did you find it stated otherwise?

Steven

Besides the big name it has behind it David D’Arcangelo who is he when he is at home? most international people would not know who he was,lets wait and see if the product is great not just good.

Well the comp plan your already gone there and what more can be said about it? Only words l can say to readers people follow people who they trust if you get involved with these start-ups.

What happens if they go belly up? you have to face and live with the fact you let many people down, to me that is not been a great leader in network marketing!

“Good is the Enemy of Great”

I do agree that some of the marketing has too much hype but still consider the services a good value. Being able to access the services in one location will save time too.

I appreciate your thoughtful discussion.

I like it that you did not censor my postings. My postings at David D’Archangelo’s blog were deleted. Over there, my postings were of an innocent nature, in my own opinion, yet David chose to delete them rather than come forward to defend his position.

These are my deleted posts over at David’s blog:

Post 1
It’s obvious David is not interested in the millions of internet savvy english writing and speaking Asians, or else he never come to this part of the world before. I wonder why he bother to call this opportunity international if he conveniently blind-sided himself to the Asia potential, or are Asians to figure out the time zones of the launch? I didn’t even bother to check when it launches, for why should we if the co-founder doesn’t bother.

Just to recap, David. The internet world is not just 12 Noon EST (9 AM Pacific, 5 PM UK, 6 PM Europe). It is India, Australia, China, South East Asia, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia, etc.

The total English speaking population of savvy internet users in these Asian countries would have drowned the whole population of UK and Europe combined. Furthermore, most in Europe do not even write or speak in English and their business websites are not in English either.

Unless you are telling us that you have the same pre-launch website in German, Italian, French, Hungarian, Dutch, Polish. Doubt so. So, would like to see a larger focus on the Asia-Australia zone before claiming your captive audience is international.

=============================================================
Post 2 (After a poster replied to me. His post was also deleted)

The reason for the rant is simple. It is not a matter of figuring it out. Like when Alan Greenspan sneezes, the market catches a cold.

So, respectfully, if the co-founder inadvertently or deliberatley leaves out a large chunk of his “captive audience”, then either his marketing research shows there is nothing much happening in Asia-Aust zone, or his marketing research tells him many French, Germans, Hungarians and Italians in Europe will be signing up. For your info, French, Germans, Hungarians and Italians are not English and these countries constitute 80% of the total population of Western Europe.

So, it is not a notion of “can’t please everybody’. It’s the message put across by the founder that will be read like how everyone read Bernake or Greenspan make their announcements. We all do read between the lines.

==============================================================

PS: It brought back memories of 2003, when I participated in a program known as CAN, based in Spain. Myself and my relatives lost alot of money when we bought many positions after reading the hugely positive comments in the CAN forum. Forum was still rather new then in 2003 and so in honesty, we all believed every posts glorifying the CAN program. After the program stalled without any initial payout, my posts in the CAN forum were similarly deleted and I had to seek my lawyer for advice. The company CAN went into silent mode and all its websites were taken down, with 403 errors. I never hear from these fraudsters anymore. It is not easy to track them down, but I have engaged PIs to hunt them down and hopefully bring them to justice. But knowing how complicated the cross-country laws are, the step to prosecute is somewhat constrained.

Now, I am seeing the same one-sided super positive comments posted at David’s blog. My advice to readers is this. Do not believe everything you read there. You can bet your last dollar that those posts which question the validity and popularity of the Webprosperity program are not posted in their own blog. To me, that is misleading the prospects into believing that it is a program not to be missed and in the absence of a counterpoint, it will be easier to brain-wash. That is deceit marketing, IMHO. I fell for it in 2003 and I would be really foolish if I fall for it again. So, I like to take this opportunity to caution readers.
If it is too good to be true, it most probably is. Don’t be brainwashed.

I am a proud MLMer. So I don’t like the blanket statement that MLM brings out the dark side.

My opinion is that the barrier to entry is so low in MLM (especially with cheap online MLM’s like WebProsperity) that newbiews flock to MLM. They lack proper education and so they go out and do bad things like “spam”.

It’s my job as a professional MLMer to educate people on building relationships instead of spamming. That’s part of the purpose of this blog and things like my ebook training “Nichework Marketing”.

You’re right, MLM has a bad reputation and I want to do what I can to fix that.

- Ben Fitts

The single motive for those who join is to make money out of those who are in their powerline while not having to pay for a single cent themselves and this deceitful and evil motive drives the motivation to join and is repeated at every level until such a level that it becomes apparent that no one else is buying into the lie anymore and then the powerline fizzes out. Someone below is going to be horribly hurt in this scheme.

Another thing, it is common knowledge that most MLM companies tighten the compensation plan when it has gathered enough victims. That is the time the top management cashes out and take a holiday. I tell you this from experience. Many will be hurt finally. Many will also forget easily the hurt and do it all over again.

Because it is always too compelling to barter for free usage of a product or service and at the same time make money by the work of your downlines. MLM personifies the dark side of human nature.

* Fear of loss
* Greed
* Laziness
* Ignorance
* Gullibility — or, if you’ve been bitten before, plain, old-fashioned stupidity

ALL FIVE Failure Factors are being heavily and directly targeted by the company and by “heavy hitter” promoters and their clones.

Bottom Line: there are too many issues, uncertainties and questionable track records involved in these aspects of the opportunity for me to be able to support it, in principle or practice.

If you decide to join WebProsperity, think seriously before complying with the company’s recommendation to allow it access to your personal contact lists: you may leave yourself exposed to the risk of prosecution and/or litigation for breaching privacy laws. Your contacts did NOT give you permission to release their private contact details to the company!

John Counsel
CEO, The Profit Clinic
http://SUCCESSinNetworkMarketing.com

Have I made a pitch for my business?

In fact one reason why I am stating this is because SOOOOO many people in my downline have approached me about Web Prosperity.

And if the product is that great, then COOL. I’ll join 6 months from now or 3 months from now or whatever. I don’t need an MLM payplan to convince me to use a service.

Whether or not the mlm is a binary or a powerline. I call it a powerline because of the “fear of loss” method they are using that the powerlines used.

- Ben

But again, you’re still misrepresenting Web Prosperity as a powerline pay structure – it is not. And as for Joe Job, do your homework on who David D’Arcangelo is – you obviously haven’t. He is not the type of guy who thinks the universe is centered around him and he has great credentials. Obviously you did sign-up during the pre-launch since you received an email regarding the times of the conference calls, and you will probably be one of many that will not actually pay to use the service. That’s typical during a launch of a new product or service. As for them delaying the launch for one week, that didn’t surprise me nor disappoint me. I believe that it will launch next week.

I’ll state it again, I find it disappointing when people will knock another product/service to try and further their own business. Why not let your product/service be your focus and be positive about it. When someone brings out the negative about others it makes your own product/service look weak.

Another thing I hate to mention is that when I receive the email about the launch, it stated 12 noon EST, 5pm UK and 6pm Europe. Now, where is Asia? If this David D’Arcangelo does not bother to acknowledge there are millions of English speaking Asians, rich and intelligent, then his company should fail eventually.I don’t even bother to figure out what time it will be over in Hong Kong where I am now…since Asia is the centre of the universe, not this David, who thinks he is.

Thanks for your post.

GREAT, but how many people can use it?

I use GoToWebinar (I have a yearly membership.) I would never be able to use WP’s webinar service.

I use Aweber and have a dozen mailing lists there already. I would never be able to use WP’s mailing list.

Top Internet Marketers all should have these services already.

So who can use these services? Novice internet marketers. That’s exactly the target market. The “experts” who are out there promoting this stuff aren’t actually going to USE the product. They just want to make money from the flock of newbies joining.

It’s truly sad.

And the powerline system is built to generate tons of hype.

What happens when the hype dies?

Look at http://www.ProBuilderPlus.com. Only 1 or two people join (for free) every hour. This is what happens when powerlines die out. AND they do fizzle out.

You look at WebProsperity today and you see several people joining every few seconds, you think great! But this market will get saturated very fast. I bet in less than 120 days.

Just my 2 cents.
- Ben Fitts

I could see how it would build fast, based on fear of loss. Or would people join and wait for everyone else do the work for them? But I did not see the residual. Did I really want to be in a fear of loss atmosphere?

Promises were made if I joined after our face-to-face meeting. I needed something to compare it with before I went into that meeting. That morning beforehand, I had a talk with your friends Jack S. and Diane.

My husband made sure I had the funds to join. But as I talked to my friend with the powerline deal, it just didn’t feel right for me. I couldn’t promote it, walked away. Should have seen the look on my husband’s face when I handed him back the check.

Later I talked to another friend who did join. They told me they didn’t make any money on the deal, and that the company went under.

I don’t know about Web Prosperity, not taking time to check it out, maybe I’m prejudiced against that business model.

Thanks – I have unsubscribed from Internet Marketers pushing this drivel.

All The Best

Alex

While I will admit that I have shifted literally ALL of my advertising in the past weeks to WebProsperity, after the launch today, I will resume my other ads — and have never stopped providing content to my niche websites during this time period.

I see WebProsperity as a money saver, so long as the products are good. If not, I’ll drop it like a hot potato. But, I’m not too worried about that happening since, as I already said, I use GetResponse as my autoresponder now.

As for not being a legitimate business, I disagree. Yes, I have focused on recruiting people in the past week or so, but in the future, I will most definitely promote the product. Anyone looking to add content to their websites or keep in touch with an email list, will need products like these. And, they will consume them and pay for them on a monthly basis. It won’t be difficult at all to have customers apart from distributors.

I don’t see how that is any different from an energy drink, vitamin, weight loss product, household product, personal care product, etc., etc., that is sold through any other MLM opportunity.

Certainly, time will tell. But, my money is on WebProsperity delivering on it’s promises.

To your success!
Cheree

You are brave to speak out against this type of marketing.

Here is another blogger with an excellent critique of WebProsperity: http://themlmteam.com/blog/2008/12/31/why-you-should-not-join-webprosperity/

Very good of you to write about this! It is indeed very bad for our industry with schemes like this.

I define business in the following simple way:

The transfer of right to goods or services from seller to buyer.

In other words – when I buy something I own it – basically.

If there is no transfer of goods and services then it is not business but a game or something like that. Some people will make money out of it still, though.

What I dislike about many mlms is that you have to fall in love with the green tooth paste at at least the double price and have to flog it all over the universe.

All earnings should be based on consumption of goods and services and on nothing but consumption.

That is business, has always been and will probably always be so.

Thanks again for bringing this up!

Best Wishes and Happy Thoughts

Rolf The Finn

PS! The drop hollows out the stone by frequent dropping, not by force!

I don’t like hype either, but I joined to use the products and for just another income source. I separately use various vendors to provide what will be under one company with Web Prosperity, so I think if you evaluate the value of what you’d otherwise need an autoresponder company, a video web conferencing service, Audio Acrobat, etc then it can make sense if you’re using those things in your business, which I do and this is less expensive, and I just see it as another affiliate program for something I use and recommend anyway.

It’s not distracting me from my primary businesses, but I’m willing to give their tools a good shot. The technology is from the company that’s behind Get Response, so they know the industry. Also being completely international and all digital delivery, it opens up the marketing worldwide and no one has to wait because it’s not available in their country yet.

Again, I agree with you about any network marketing opportunity should be based very strongly on products/services that people would use anyway, and the MLM business model is just a smart way to spread the word. Plus there’s no cost to join, just choose between 2 service levels, so I see no downside unless the tools aren’t good.

My two cents,

Becki

You drilled it straight on the head!

Thank goodness, someone has the experience,
and honesty to call a spade, a spade, very
refreshing!

In my experience these types of programs,
are just “money games” and not real products
that add value to peoples lives…and in the
end they are the ones that give MLM, and IM
a bad rep…

Having a great mentor like Ben Fitts,
to guide us thru this “killer fog” is
indeed, a blessing!

Way to keep it real, Ben!

Best Wishes,
Jeff Davis

Like you, i don’t have much faith in the hype … in 9 years here I’ve seen it all … come and mostly go.

Thanks Ben … we need more honest people like you online who aren’t afraid to voice the truth.

KOODOS!

Janet Legere
List Building Expert

Hooray for more sanity…

The herd mentality will continue to drive more
aspiring Marketers to the Poor House.

I am surprised at some of
the “names” who are touting this Farce.

Actually I will seriously look at the PRODUCT, but Opportunity…

NO WAY

The system is and always been Flawed.

Kudos to you Young man!
Your professionalism Shines

There will be some BIG money made among a handful…